Curse

Yanman.be · Oct 17, 2007, 09:34 AM // 09:34

The 15% applies only to base damage, yet that doesn't mean you should ditch it. Any number adds up.

Bobby2 · Oct 17, 2007, 10:11 AM // 10:11

That is true. But for the same result (+5e), people are willing to wear Radiant. An alternative, as Shuuda proposed, is Survivor. Now we're talking +25HP (equivalent locations). This is 'a lot' too.

Maybe it's an attitude change. Despite generally running no self-heal anymore, I want to build 'to last'. If it entails sacrificing such a small percentage of damage to have this extra leverage - both in HP and Energy? I'd have to think it over.

In any case, at DM 14, a Blossom critical can hit 100+ still. So it's not like it plummets after the conditional +15% is removed.

segnisletum · Oct 17, 2007, 12:39 PM // 12:39

As said several times, its all a matter of preference. Pve I prefer the 5e to avoid using radiant/attunement runes. On top of that, lvl difference affects crit chance lowering the difference anyways. Living>+20 damage. And 20 damage isn't going to make or break a pve skirmish.

Pvp I switch daggers but usually in 15% more in some form or fashion. Only go to 5e if I have a chance for a spike and for some reason I don't think my energy is high enough for my chain.

Though why people bring up pvp in the campfire all the time I don't know...

Yanman.be · Oct 17, 2007, 02:57 PM // 14:57

So like, switch daggers y'know.

Bobby2 · Oct 18, 2007, 04:07 AM // 04:07

Like, sure. ^^ Toying around with several weapon sets has proven quite useful at energy-management.

Sqube · Oct 22, 2007, 06:06 PM // 18:06

A lot of the people here seem to be operating under the assumption that you can only use one pair of daggers, ever.

Zealous 15^50 of Fortitude/Enchantment (general use)
Elemental 15^50 of Fortitude/Enchantment (Warriors, synergy with other skills)
Vampiric 15^50 of Fortitude/Enchantment (when you need every last point of damage)
Zealous +5E of Fortitude (for when you have DP)

Obviously, you bring your specialized daggers for when you're running a Temple Strike build, or if you want the poison to last for as long as possible, but I really feel like the above four daggers takes care of just about every imaginable situation.

You would probably replace the vampiric daggers with one of those +60 HP staffs for kiting if you're doing organized PvP; I've never done it, so I wouldn't know. But for PvE and disorganized PvP, I feel the four daggers I've listed above should be in every sin's toolbox. There. I said it.

Bowstring Badass · Oct 23, 2007, 12:29 AM // 00:29

Let This Die Already It Is Annoying Carry A Pair Of Both. +5 When You Have Dp. Done End Of Story Stfu And Take Your Fail With You.

kazjun · Oct 23, 2007, 02:32 AM // 02:32

Sounds interesting, though I wonder why you don't just carry multiple weaps. You do get 4 weap slots after all.

Still, why don't you test this on the master of damage on the isle of the nameless if you want good numbers? See if the extra energy will let you spike for more or longer as compared to the damage from a 15^50?

Yanman.be · Oct 23, 2007, 08:16 AM // 08:16

You can bring as many weapons as you have inventory slots.

I color code then myself for easy reconaissance.

Ekelon · Oct 24, 2007, 02:34 AM // 02:34

The only good thing about +5e daggers IMO is that you can pull off a combo with DP, otherwise, 20 damage is a lot (the difference b/w killing you're opponent or not killing him).

As many people have probably already pointed out, your tests are inaccurate, your average for no damage boost was 19.9, then with +15% it was 18 something... shouldn't it be higher?

Saphatorael · Oct 24, 2007, 07:07 PM // 19:07

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...0&postcount=43

SotiCoto · Oct 25, 2007, 11:39 AM // 11:39

Simply put... to the original post and anyone else who uses the +5e...

If you cannot manage your enemy without using +5e weapons, Radiant Insignias or Attunement runes..... then you're not playing well. I've been there. I've learnt better.
I use Nightstalker's Armour and 15%/Enchant Daggers (No Critical Agility = Fail)... and have absolutely ZERO problems with energy 95% of the time (yes, even against packs of Roaring Ethers... though several Mist Vaettirs with AV/SV up can get the better of me).

If you're playing properly... +5 energy won't make a single shred of difference. You'd be better off with 10% faster spell recharge chance than that (because every Assassin almost has at least one spell on their skillbar).
That then leads to the next point made by Yan earlier:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yanman.be

The 15% applies only to base damage, yet that doesn't mean you should ditch it. Any number adds up.

QFT.

Sqube · Oct 25, 2007, 07:34 PM // 19:34

SotiCoto, I don't know that I would say that not being able to run your assassin with 25 energy makes you an automatic fail... but I'm going to try it out. I'm running Zealous 15^50 daggers for the first time in my life, so I'm interested in how it's going to work out.

Besides, I've tried running with 38 energy, and it was funny. Pointless, but funny. I mean, I didn't need anything near the amount of energy that I had. 15^50 for my daggers and health runes all around will be quite a difference for me.

And +5e daggers will always be good for DP, so poo!

Shuuda · Oct 25, 2007, 10:42 PM // 22:42

SotiCoto, do remember to post the combo you use. And as Sqube, when DP sets in, +5 comes out to play, it can make all the difference in PvP

SotiCoto · Oct 26, 2007, 09:56 AM // 09:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sqube

SotiCoto, I don't know that I would say that not being able to run your assassin with 25 energy makes you an automatic fail... but I'm going to try it out. I'm running Zealous 15^50 daggers for the first time in my life, so I'm interested in how it's going to work out.

Make sure you have at least 13 Critical Strikes and Critical Agility. The IAS definitely ups the Criticals-per-unit-time. If you're still having difficulty, bring Critical Eye as well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shuuda

SotiCoto, do remember to post the combo you use. And as Sqube, when DP sets in, +5 comes out to play, it can make all the difference in PvP

[skill]Golden Phoenix Strike[/skill][skill]Critical Strike[/skill][skill]Moebius Strike[/skill][skill]Death Blossom[/skill]
Critical Strike is such an obscene energy-spike AND good for refreshing Critical Defenses... I never leave outpost without it.
And what was that about PvP?
PvP's lack of Critical Agility = fail. >_<;

Saphatorael · Oct 26, 2007, 10:40 AM // 10:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

PvP's lack of Critical Agility = fail. >_<;

Yeh, I demand that There Is Nothing To Fear! also gets put in PvP, Paragons suck without lolol

SotiCoto · Oct 26, 2007, 11:04 AM // 11:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saphatorael

Yeh, I demand that There Is Nothing To Fear! also gets put in PvP, Paragons suck without lolol

This has nothing to do with Paragons (though I do like the skill in question); This is Sparta! .... Wait... no.... This is the Assassin Board!
*Coughs*
But really... compared to Critical Agility, any other IAS an Assassin can use is substandard. It really does wipe the floor with them.

Ben-A-BoO · Oct 26, 2007, 11:14 AM // 11:14

Offtopic:

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

... any other IAS an Assassin can use is substandard.

There is a reason why there is no IAS under the assassin skills ... it's called game balance (for pvp - since it seems not to matter anymore in pve eg. consumables etc.) Remember what happened when Burst of Aggression was around?

On Topic:

Swap weapons

SotiCoto · Oct 26, 2007, 11:34 AM // 11:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by timebandit

There is a reason why there is no IAS under the assassin skills ... it's called game balance (for pvp - since it seems not to matter anymore in pve eg. consumables etc.) Remember what happened when Burst of Aggression was around?

I don't know what happened to Burst of Aggression, but Assassins are still using short-duration Warrior IAS skills in PvP to the best of my knowledge... and it isn't giving them a major advantage above and beyond other classes, so I fail to see the issue.
Critical Agility probably would, if introduced... but it isn't going to be.

Yanman.be · Oct 26, 2007, 02:25 PM // 14:25

BoA was a rather long IAS with short rc, and a downside that didn't affect sins, so they abused it.